If fathers have to pay child support for children they didn't want, should mothers have to pay compensation for a child that he wanted, but the mother aborted?
There's a recent issue proposed saying women need the father's permission to get an abortion, and if she can't prove the father, or prove that she was raped, she's out of luck. While I'm all for father's having equal rights, but I think this proposal is horrible, and I don't think it's right to force a person to do anything. A mother should be able to do whatever she wants, but should there be consequences as well?
So, I have my "this for that" idea. What do you think?
Answers:
Good one. A woman does have the right to her body and her choices, but, there is an argument in her aborting a wanted child. Should there be any consequences to her?
This is one of the many problems that surface when you have an unbalanced Child Support system in place. You can't play favorites.
imagine it were YOUR body...how would you feel about somebody telling you what you can/can't do.
i think you make a good point.
No, because child support is to support the child, not compensate the mother for anything.
i think it makes since to try to have both parents in agreement over abortion. But the whole paying the father or what not seems ridiculous because when the mother is getting child support, it is money going towards raising a child. if it the father getting paid because the mom decided to get an abortion, where would the money go towards?! i know, beer and hookers.
haven't considered those things
I don't have kids
I would have to consider it awhile
obviously people should pay for and support the kids
if I had kids , I would feed them first, then me
The "risks" of pregnancy and fatherhood (and motherhood) are assumed at the time the two people have unprotected sex. If you don't want the risk of being a dad, use a condom or have vasectomy.
If a woman gets pregant, it is her choice whether to deliver the child or abort it and as long as it's her body and she has to deliver the kid (a fate I could not be paid enough to undertake) you are stuck w/ it.
Since men cannot have babies, then I believe it's totally the women's right to do what she wants to do with her own body.
Dont say "FATHERS" say "PARENTS"...I paid support and had custody of the kids but I made more money then him...
As far as the abortion goes...Its the womans decision...HER BODY...Although I dont believe in them its still her body ...her pregnancy...like someone else said...be careful who you "donate" to...
The proposal you describe will never be enacted. If it is enacted it will not hold up against a constitutional arguement -- the right to privacy. The woman's right to choose about an abortion is her personal right ... the law you describe would gut her personal rights. In gutting that right it would affect many other personal rights we all take for granted so . . .
As for a guy.. it does seem unfair that after he "donates" his sperm he has absolutely no right to choose either way. However, it was his choice to donate the sperm.
This is not how the law looks at it. Most women discuss a decision as weighty as abortion with the fathers. The ones that do not are being abused, mentally or physically, or were raped. Imagine a husband who forced his wife to have sex with him because he wants her to get pregnant. It would be nearly impossible to prove the rape, because it happened in the context of a marriage (where sex is usually consensual and expected). If the man knew the woman aborted "his" child (and that is how he thinks of it -- as "his" child), then odds are very high that he would come after the mother in some way. This is why courts strike down laws that even require spousal notification (not permission). Even if the notification comes after the fact, in the form of "compensation" (which alerts the man that the woman has aborted), the dangers are high.
On the other hand, once a child is born, both parents have an obligation to support it. Remember, the father only pays child support when the child lives with the mother. There are plenty of single fathers out there who are entitled to child support from their childrens' mothers. You can think what you want about abortion, but the fact remains that ONCE a child is born, the parents must support it. That's why people must pay child support. On the other hand, the decision to abort, or not, is much more complicated and fraught with possibilities of retaliation, violence, etc., and so i think your "this for that" idea would probably cause more problems than it would solve.
BOTH parents have to pay child support for any children born -- it's not gender specific.
And BOTH parents have the right to refuse to contribute their genetic material in the first place.
The issue about stopping is pregnancy mid-term doesn't concern the father, because he's not biologically involved in the process during the pregnancy. Just like neither genetic parent has the right to demand or prevent an abortion for a surrogate -- they are not involved in the actual process of the pregnancy.
It's called a woman having a constitutional fundamental right (see penumbra of rights in the Lawrence v. Texas case to get a better grip) to make decisions about her OWN body. Fortunately, those decisions are NOT determined by your needs, wants or desires. For further reading, read: Griswold v. Connecticut, Casey v. State of Pennsylvania, and Roe v. Wade. If a woman of legal majority age chooses to terminate her pregnancy in the first trimester, it is solely her own decision. Some fathers have argued for rights to the unborn child but have universally failed because THEN his rights would supercede the Mother's right to her own body.
You have NO right to impose pregnancy on another woman, no matter what your feelings are in the matter. Pregnancy is a very personal choice for the woman carrying a baby. Your body becomes distorted, your hormones rage, your breasts grow large and are very sore, and you feel vulnerable. Some women become deathly ill... lose weight or gain too much, have pre ecclampsia or other life threatening illness, or miscarry. Some even BLEED TO DEATH. Carrying this kind of burden when in love and expecting the baby can be tolerable, but being FORCED to carry a child is enough to send any woman into a mental and physical stress that some would never recover from. Some poor mothers even commit suicide when they cannot afford or obtain an abortion.
Would you want the suicide of the mother being forced to carry YOUR baby on your conscience? Think about it.
Great Q..
The abortion debate is spot on in that effectively that clause would force a woman to do something with her body she did not want to do. There is no legal equivalent where a man is coerced into doing something he does not want to with his body.
As for men being compensated for a child they did not want - this is tricky. Many men do not pay for their children anyway - and a few women for that matter but the issue of compensation is tricky in that when a new life is created it is not the needs/rights of the parents that is paramount - it is the rights of the child.
Men and women for that matter have the choice to protect themselves or not. Men can wear a jacket if they do not want a child and have a choice at the getting a gal pregnant stage. No contraception is 100% though and many men accept no responsibility in this dept. so 'accidents' will happen.
Those accidents have feelings and thoughts and deserve not to know their own father wanted compensated because they were born..how awful would that be.
Since most single parents are women and women still do the lions share of child caring, sorting out contraception etc I really do not think it is too much to ask that fathers and absent mothers pay for the upkeep of their children. Whatever the child support in most cases it is not that much anyway - 15% for a first child in the UK - compared to what the resident parent spends it is nowt.
Raising a child is the hardest job in the world - a woman who takes contraception that does not work is in a no win situation if her partner wants to take no responsibility. If she aborts she has to live with that and if she keeps the child every single day for the rest of her life she must look after and care for that new life.
Are you saying that as well as being able to kick his heels and leave her literally holding the baby the father should get monetary compensation from the women thus taking more money away from the wee soul who did not ask to come into this world??
In a situation where the father is either absent or deceased what are the woman's rights? Yes I believe in a father's right to his child but there has to be a better way of accomplishing rights.
No I dont believe a mother should pay compensation for a child she aborted. The point of child support is to take care of the child not to compensate the other parent. It doesnt matter if the father wanted the child or not.
Reality Check- If you make an adult decision to have sex you have to deal with the adult chances of pregnancy. You cant scream and cry like a child afterwards "Its not fair!!"
Compensation is not the way to "balance" the battle over parents rights. I personally dont believe abortion would ever be an option for me and I also am a firm believer in my above statement. Man and woman made an adult decision to have sex and man and woman have to face the music. So this situation would be completly hypothetical for me.
I'm afraid I don't understand your stance on this issue. Everyone gets all up in arms about "Deadbeat Dads", and how unconscionable it is for a man to not step up to his responsibilities, after all, the woman didn't conceive by herself.
Now when a man says, I want to take responsibility and I'll be responsible for the pre-natal through post-natal care of the mother and I will take full custody and raise my child, women all the sudden say men have no rights to their unborn children. You say you're "all for father's having equal rights", yet you qualify with a "but".
Either you believe the child is a product of the action of two people and as such, both should have input and decision making ability concerning the unborn child, or you believe that the child is the sole responsibility of the mother, giving her exclusive decision making over its fate.
If you choose the latter, then no woman has any expectation for any man to support a child that she conceives and delivers. You can't have your cake and eat it too!
While the mother is the one bearing the child, I think the father has a choice, afterall without the father the child in question would not exist.. nor would there be thoughts of an abortion, but I also think there should be clauses in any proposed laws, that assist women that are victims of sexual crimes.
not a bad way of thinking,but still a bit over the top. not all pregnancies are a result of unprotected sex.
*laughs* This is an interesting topic. Take a star for it.
There was an articule about a man wanting the abortion and the woman wanting the child (the fertilized eggs had been frozen because the woman had cancer) this I remember reading, because the man won and the eggs were destroyed so she can't have kids now.
There's also another case where basically a judge ruled that the man ejaculated for 3 seconds while the woman got 9 months of labour so therefore it was her decision.
Okie dokie if a law passes, a lot of women are going to be saying they had one night stands or getting their male friends that support them. For example this law was in place I can just get my cousin (who is rather protective of me) to say he's the father and sign the documentation. Unless the clinic is able to do a DNA test on both the foetus and the father to which case I can just say, "crap I cheated on you darling".
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